Interview Edition: Hope Is Not a Strategy. with Qiara Suggs, Chief People Officer

If you've ever stayed somewhere too long because the title looked good on paper, this one's for you. Qiara Suggs got told no for a promotion she'd earned twice over — and turned that no into the executive seat she holds today. We pulled the curtain back on what it actually takes to drive your own career when nobody else is going to drive it for you.

About the Guest

Qiara Suggs is the Chief People Officer at TDECU, the largest credit union in Houston and one of the four largest in Texas, where she leads people strategy, corporate real estate, enterprise strategy, and enterprise project management. A fixture in the Houston HR community and a U of H alum, she's the kind of senior HR voice this show was built for.

What You'll Learn

• Why hope is not a strategy — and the one question a mentor asked Qiara that flipped her entire career
• How to tell when your job description is the floor — and when it's quietly becoming the ceiling
• The difference between leaving for the right reason and leaving because you're hurt (and how to tell which one you're in)
• Why every no is a yes somewhere else — but only if you stay in the driver's seat
• What HR actually does behind the scenes — and why "HR is not your friend" is a worse take than the internet thinks
• How to navigate being the only one in the room without letting it define your brand

Timestamps

00:00 — Cold open: why this conversation matters now 

01:49 — Qiara's role at TDECU and the case for going "non-traditional" 

04:01 — Mentors, and why your village beats your résumé 

06:52 — The leader's job: betting on people who haven't yet bet on themselves 

09:18 — "I won't do extra work for free" vs. showing your real ceiling 13:36 — Career growth isn't always vertical — and why that's the point 

17:49 — Don't get stuck. Get in the driver's seat. 

19:10 — The promotion that didn't happen — and what Njsane did next 

24:13 — Every "no" is a "yes" somewhere else 

26:54 — Total comp, the dollar trap, and the long game 

30:36 — Don't quit mad. Make it a business decision. 

33:53 — HR as friend, not villain — and what's really happening behind the scenes 

41:12 — Being the only one in the room without losing yourself in it 

50:02 — When leadership requires courage, not consensus 

52:37 — Closing reflections and what's next

Referenced episode: From Hourly to Salary: Promotion or Prank? — Season 1 on Buzzsprout

Your Move

• Subscribe so you don't miss the next one → https://www.buzzsprout.com/2173681
• Get the newsletter in your inbox every other week → [insert Mailchimp signup link]
• Connect with Qiara Suggs on LinkedIn
• Connect with Njsane → linkedin.com/in/njsanecourtney
• Bringing this conversation to your organization or conference? → myfriendinhr@gmail.com

#MyFriendInHR #HRLeadership #CareerGrowth

Transcript

Meet Kiera Suggs And Her Why

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Welcome back, Career Conquerors. Look, I am so excited as you probably heard in the intro. We are being joined by a personal hero, Kiera Suggs. She is the Chief Human Resources Officer of TECU. I look, beyond her title, I'm going to tell you something about this amazing woman. First of all, if you are in the Houston metro area at all, she is everywhere. She's, you know, the Houston Business Journal. She's at all kinds of women empowerment lunches. She gives back to the community as well as hasn't a very impressive career. And uh I'm just so fortunate that she and I have been able to connect and we have this great, cool, collaborative relationship. And I'm just so happy to have her on the show. So, Kier, welcome to the mic drop. How are you doing, my dear?

SPEAKER_00 0:40

I'm doing so awesome. Just it's awesome to be in good company. So thank you for giving me this opportunity. I really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 0:47

No, this is great. You you have a really cool story to tell. And I think one of the things we always want to try to offer our community is just a no-nonsense look at what does it take to be successful, defining what your type of success really looks like, because everybody's path is a little bit different. And let people understand that where we are right now didn't happen overnight. And it didn't happen alone, usually. There's a lot of people that kind of helped us get to where we're going to be. So let's jump right into it, right? So you are the chief human resources officer for the largest credit union in Houston. And I think you guys like the fourth, fourth largest in Texas. I'm impressed. Listen, I try to learn about my heroes. That's what happens. And so that's a massive, massive undertaking. And just saying that you manage human resources for the organization really does not do justice for all the things you're asked to do. Like most of us were asked to wear multiple hats. So kind of talk about what your remit is, what it is you do, and what brings you joy every day when you go into the office.

SPEAKER_00 1:49

Well, that's such a good question. And thank you for doing your research because when most people think about TDECU, they wonder what credit unions do. And I have to tell you, coming from various industries, the credit union space is a hidden industry. And I wish I would have learned about it a long time ago. And it's because we are in the business of impacting people's lives. And one of the reasons why I chose TDECU is because from a values perspective, I firmly believe in helping people transform them their lives just like others have helped me. And I see you doing that, Jasani, and the way that you create these various platforms. But um, so my my role is chief human capital officer, and the short end of what I do is I make decisions that impact people's lives on a daily basis in a positive way. And so I have sort of a non-traditional role where I oversee human resources, corporate real estate, I've got enterprise strategy, enterprise project management. And the list goes on and on, but it's not about having this broad spectrum of work. My passion and desire has always been to impact folks in a way that allows me to be in a non-traditional position. Right. And so as chief human capital officer, I actually have the pleasure of working with some amazing people. My CEO is such a blessing where he gives me the autonomy to make decisions independently, but there's a lot of work that comes with carrying that burden. But I work across a team of peers that continue to be lockstep in everything that we do. But most importantly, every single one of my direct reports down to my individual contributors are amazing. And they too have the autonomy to make decisions that impact our organization from a people perspective. It doesn't matter if you're an HR or not. Everyone knows that we are the heartbeat of the organization and every decision that we make impacts our employees, which then translates to our members. So it's a blessing. I have had a non-traditional

What A CHRO Actually Owns

SPEAKER_00 3:50

um path in this space that I'm in, but I love it. And there's a story to be told about going a little rogue and finding your space in your perfection. So yeah, that's a little bit about what I do.

SPEAKER_01 4:03

So let's jump right into the aspect of, you know, how you got here, your path to where you are, um, and and the and some of those key moments, right, that that had you, that, that brought you with you to where you are right now. So I always talk about the power of networking, the power of collaborating, the power of finding a mentor and things like that. So, how have those elements impacted your career in terms of like getting to where you are right now, and it wasn't recognizing that it's not a solo game?

SPEAKER_00 4:35

Yeah, everything that you just said. So I firmly believe in having a village, both personally and professionally in life. And so you mentioned mentors, there's advocates, there's decision makers, there's community leaders who can further influence your path in life. And I wouldn't be where I am had it not been for individuals taking a chance on me. So I'll tell you early on when I started my career in HR, I had a chance to experience an internship with Burnett Staffing. And most people know Sue Burnett. She is one of the largest woman-owned business staffing agencies in the greater Houston area and beyond. And her firm belief is giving people a chance. And had it not been for her and her team giving me a chance back when I was at University of Houston Houston over 20 years ago, I wouldn't be where I am. Yes, go. I drink the U of H Kool-Aid, and thank you for representing U of H on your shirt today.

SPEAKER_01 5:32

But it's just Again, doing my homework. Doing my homework, I do what we're talking to.

SPEAKER_00 5:36

Thank you. That matters. But it's folks like Sue who make a difference in the world today. And I've taken that on myself with ensuring that I give people a chance. So I've had challenges throughout my career where I've tried to figure out what I wanted to do. So I sort of fell into HR because Burnett Staffing introduced me to what that looked like in the healthcare space. And then I also had others, when I got into healthcare, I would say, hey, I want to learn a little bit more about this role or what you do in your role. And folks would say, All right, come under my wing. I'll let you sit into these conversations. Or others have said, you know what? I'm gonna bet on you and I'm gonna allow you to work in this position or work on this project or take on a little bit more because I know your potential or I see your potential. And again, I had to believe in my own potential, and others had to give me those opportunities to be able to flex some of those new muscles to navigate my career. So it's been an exciting journey. I've gone from individual contributor now to an executive level role, and I certainly am intentional with ensuring that whether you're an individual, you're a manager, or up through the executive level, you too have that opportunity to flex some new muscles and to try something new to expand your scope and responsibilities.

SPEAKER_01 6:52

Like you have not been an HR long if you have not heard of Subernet, right? I think a lot of us owe our careers. I actually did a temporary assignment for Burnett staffing years and years and years and years ago. Um, and so it's funny because, you know, people think, oh, a temporary worker or you go through a staffing agency for an opportunity and things like that. Uh a lot of us got our start that way, right? Just to get our foot in the door. And I hear that over and over again for people who are interested in human resources, like, oh, it's just so hard to get in. And I warn people all the time, like, okay, be careful because once you get in, you can't get out. You're stuck, you're kind of stuck, you're kind of stuck with it. But how important is it for leaders to take a chance on people when you see something in them that they don't see in themselves?

SPEAKER_00 7:37

Yeah, I think it's a wonderful question. And I think when you are in a position of influence, period, title or not, it's important that you use that influence for good. There are so many people in our organization, for example, that have so much potential, but they doubt themselves because maybe they're in their comfort zone and they've been accustomed to more of a traditional career path than one that is less traditional. And at TDECU, we're very intentional with showing people how to not only navigate your career in a maybe a traditional way, but also to expand your scope and look at a career path that can sort of take you from one function to another. What's been interesting is that when we have navigated crises, which all organizations do, we ask people to lock arms and we ask people to sort of step out of their comfort zone and focus their effort on the crisis. And what we've learned is that there are people that have so many skill sets that they didn't even realize they had. And they've been able to blossom in a space where, you know, maybe they function in a branch, for example. But we've got this crisis that needs support over here, and they've worked on the technology space. We have folks that have now been able to navigate their career in a space where they've grown from working in a branch to another function that is much more enterprise-wide. So to your original question, we we need to help people understand their potential, but it first starts with believing in yourself. So how do you help people believe in their self first and then as a leader or as someone of influence, help to

The Village Behind Career Growth

SPEAKER_00 9:10

foster those skill sets in a way that is exposed and it gives people an opportunity to do more than what they could even imagine.

SPEAKER_01 9:18

So there's gonna be people who are gonna listen to what you just said, and they're gonna be like, okay, here's two HR executives, and they're talking this utopian, yeah. Give people a chance and all this other stuff, right? But there's another side of this. There's a there's a side to this where, you know, employees do need to kind of step up and make themselves seen and heard, right? Leaders who have an obligation to look for those hidden gems, but at the same time, employees can't just sit back on their laurels and expect promotions and things to be handed to them, you know, in terms of in terms of doing that. And now I was have it's funny, I was having a conversation with an employee once, and she had this mentality of, I mean, I saw it. She had so much potential. She had all these things going for her, but yeah, she had this mentality care where I'm not gonna do it unless they pay me more, right? Well, they're not gonna get any free work from me. And so that is a bit of a balancing act because let's be honest, companies will, whatever you give them, they'll take, they'll, they'll use it. But at the same time, sometimes you have to stretch yourself. You have to let people see you in those bigger roles before you get the bigger roles. So, how do you coach employees in terms of balancing that feeling of really I should do all this extra work for free versus let me show them what I can do first? You know, that that's kind of a it's kind of a conflict at times.

SPEAKER_00 10:31

Yeah, I it's such a it's kind of the loaded question, and and I'll start here. I tell my kids on a daily basis, you can do anything you put your mind to. So if if you say you can't, you can't. If you say you can, you can. And so first you have to start with what am I trying to accomplish and where do I want to go? So you need to have a clear path and not necessarily depend on someone else to build that path for you. And that could be getting a new skill set. It could be, you know, taking your career to the next level, whatever that means, but you have to define it and you can't expect someone else to define that for you. With that being said, I'll be the first to say that hard work doesn't always get you to where you want to go. So back to your point earlier, your network is critically important. And I firmly believe that your network, it shows your net worth, right? So oftentimes people they try to compare themselves to other colleagues and they'll say, I have much more than this other individual and they got promoted to X. Well, it could be they know the right people at the right time, or they've been much more assertive in sharing the skill sets that they even think they have, right? And so if you're sitting back and waiting for someone to tap you on the shoulder, that's not a good strategy. You have to figure out a strategy that is going to help to differentiate who you are. And even if you don't have the skill set, speak to where you're trying to go so that people can believe in who you are and your potential. With that being said, we all work harder than you can even imagine, right? And so I I tell people all the time, I'm working for every penny that I make. Plus, plus I need some more, right? Because it's a job description, is just that it is a broad sheet of paper or a broad description that gives you a general assessment of what your role is. If you stay within that box, you are gonna remain in that position, or people are only going to see you in that role because you're saying, well, that's not on my job description. However, if you're willing to go above and beyond and advocate for yourself and show your potential and network with the right people, typically your dreams and the possibilities come to fruition. But it's there's not always a dollar amount associated with the hard work. Now, you need to know what you're worth. And frankly, I'll be the first to say if an organization isn't paying you what you think you're worth, you have a decision to make. And so like either you stay and you continue to hope, which hope is not a strategy. You have to actively position yourself, or you can be proactive and find another organization that you feel is a better fit for you. There's a mutual, there's a symbiotic relationship in an employer and an employee relationship. So you've you've got to take control of your career. And that means that be active, proactive, and advocate for yourself. Position yourself to differentiate. Do more than your job description. And if if you're not in a space where you feel like you're receiving what you need and you're giving your all, then take the chance and go somewhere else to find another opportunity that offers you what you need.

SPEAKER_01 13:36

I that is that is so true. I, you know, and it's funny, you you said so many great things in that in that uh segment. I when I look back at my career, my career where I am right now, and of me being able to do the things I do, there's like two or three decisions I intentionally made that did not that require me to take on more that did not directly lead to compensation because mobility, you know, moving moving along your career doesn't always is not always a vertical path. Sometimes you got to go here and then here, and then you end up being here. And so it's one of those things where I'm always telling people, look, it's like any relationship. You know when you're getting used, you know when you're getting misused, you know it, right? But there is that symbiotic relationship, as you were saying, it's it's a reciprocity. We're all mercenaries, right? Yeah. We are where we are because what that company offered from compensation and benefits and the total rewards, you know, mesh with what we needed, and we had skills that the organization needed needed at the time. And so right now, there's, you know, like I said, there's a give and take. But you always have to reevaluate. You always have to reevaluate is where I am right now going to get me to where I want to be. And you hit it so well a minute ago, like you have to have that vision because you won't know where you're going. And if you're just thinking about that paycheck, if you're just thinking about uh, you know, the short term, then you're really missing out on creating this beautiful, beautiful story called Your Career that can take you places. I mean, listen, I am a black man from a small town in central Louisiana. At the time I was growing up, we probably had 50,000 folks. And I have been so blessed in my career to put my feet down in almost every continent to meet so many cultures, right? And I tell people all the time if my country tale can make it happen. Yeah. There are people way smarter and way more creative than me out there. You can totally do it. But as you said, Kira, you have to be your own career manager. You have to figure out what that vision is, and you sometimes have to make decisions that will put you on that path.

SPEAKER_00 15:46

I just I want to add a little bit more to that because I thank you for sharing your personal story because I think what happens is people see where you are and they don't necessarily see the struggle that comes in in your journey, right? And so I I firmly believe that as a professional, you have to stay in the driver's seat. And so back to the whole mentor, mentee relationship that you mentioned, I'll tell you, there was a point in my career where I was extremely frustrated. And I had, I sort of plateaued and I could do my job like the back of my hand, I knew how to navigate my employer. Anyone could ask me any question, and I knew exactly how to navigate these challenges across the organization. And I was talking to one of my mentors in a moment of frustration, and I was sort of going through everything that was wrong, and yeah, but you know, I continue to get it exceeds expectations. And here are some of the things that I'm trying to navigate. And and they're saying that I'm the epitome of a perfect HR professional. And my mentee said, or my mentor said, All right, Kira, what are you gonna do about it? You can either complain or you can do something about it, right? You can stay and you can sulk or you can do something about it. And fast forward, I did something about it. I I chose to explore other opportunities because I was ready to be challenged. I had a vision for where I wanted to go. I knew that I could do more. And it's nothing against my previous employer, but it was important for me to get in the driver's seat and take control and then sort of nestle on what does it mean to do something about it? Right. And so I had to elevate my brand. I wanted to differentiate. I had to be clear and thoughtful in my path. So I would just challenge your listeners and for anyone who finds themselves in a similar situation. One, don't get stuck in where you are. Embrace what you're experiencing that moment, but use that energy for good

Handling Plateaus And Rejection

SPEAKER_00 17:40

and do something about it. Don't get stuck in your situation because you're not courageous enough to take a chance and bet on yourself and stay in the driver's seat.

SPEAKER_01 17:49

There you go. So I want to go down kind of a kind of a different path for a moment. You know, we talked about having to make those decisions. And sometimes those decisions are like crazy scary, right? They're scary. They take us out, take us out of outside of our comfort zone, and there's risk and all these other things. Because at the end of the day, we all got bills to pay, right? We got bills to pay, we got families to support, we got dreams to fulfill, we got all these things going on. And sometimes the decisions that we make could impact some of those, one or all of those things. I remember in my career, there was one time uh at a former employer where I did not get a promotion that I knew I deserved. I've talked about this a few times on my podcast. It was one of the most frustrating things because at the end of the day, they it was a, you know, sometimes in HR, a lot of HR organizations are very flat. There's not a lot of levels of management. So when that those management positions became available, you're like, oh, it's really sought after. And although on paper care, I it supported these three particular business units. And over the seven years I had been at that company, I had been the HR business partner for each one of those business units. And so this management role was gonna oversee it. Long story short, I didn't get it. And actually, they gave it to somebody who had maybe a third of the tenure that I had. And no knock to that individual, because he and I are still friends today. Um he applied, I applied to the Victor goes to spoils. But I gotta tell you, I was pissed. I was mad, I was frustrated, I was hurt. And it was back, it was back in the day before taking a mental health date was even a cool thing to do. Right. Um, back in the early 2000s, it wasn't about I need to take a mental health date. There was none of that. But I took a I took two or three mental health days, and I remember I took my badge off, I put my company phone down, and when I walked out of the office, I didn't tell my boss. So they could have easily got me for job abandonment. They could have totally, they could have totally got me for it, but I think they kind of knew, and they did give me a couple of days to kind of figure that out. But over those two or three days, to your point, I had to make a decision. I had to figure out can I get past this? Is this something that I want to deal with and continue to work through? Or do I put my, do I go look somewhere else and go to another organization and things like that? And I ultimately did decide to go to another company, no knock to the performer employer at all. But it was that time in my career when I wanted to manage my own HR department. Can you talk a little bit about a frustration that you had to go through to evolve you into the amazing professional that you are now?

SPEAKER_00 20:15

Yeah, I your story resonates so much where I have been there and done that. And the energy, as much as I'm telling everybody to channel that energy at the time, I was in a vulnerable, vulnerable space where, you know, my career path looked as if it was moving up the organization at the time. I'm like, oh, they're betting on me. You know, they they see me as that next person. All of my performance evaluations are showing that I am shining. So when that next opportunity opens up, I know they've got me. There's no doubt. Like they're telling me everything that I need to hear. I've asked for constructive feedback, and I'm like, I'm not getting constructive feedback. They're saying keep doing what you're doing. And unfortunately, life doesn't work that way. Life is not always fair. And I've had a situation exactly what you said. The opportunity surfaced. I put my name in the hat, went through the interview process, sort of saw some red flags through the interview process. And if you're an HR, you kind of know like when the organization has already decided on someone else, but you still hang on to that hope. It's just you live in a world when you you sort of know behind the scenes what's happening. And so it was just being in a space where you know what happens behind the scenes and you're the candidate, there's still this glimpse of hope where you're thinking, nah, they like I am going to be strongly considered. All the evidence shows that I'm ready. And in this particular incident, I wasn't chosen. And I was told that one leader said, You know what, you weren't chosen, but I'm gonna take you under my wing and help you get to where you need to go. You'll You'll be considered next, and essentially. What I've learned is every no is a yes for somewhere else. And it was because of that incredibly hard time that crippled my confidence in that moment that I then decided I I literally told this leader, it's time for me to take control of my career. Like you had to do what was important for this organization, and I fully respect it. We had an amicable relationship. But personally, I knew it was time for me to take control of my career. And sometimes it takes for you to get knocked down a couple times for you to shift your strategy to bet on yourself. And what you see today is me shifting my strategy, betting on myself, differentiating my brand. And to be frank, I can't be more happier than I am today than I was, you know, if 10 years ago, if you would have asked me, you know, are you gonna go anywhere? I would have said, no. I love what I'm doing. I am so glad that I was told no. I'm so glad that I was knocked down because I now have a level of confidence that shows that I can do anything I put my mind to, which is what I tell my kids, right? So it resonates. I'm preaching to my kids. I need to take my own advice. But it's interesting because earlier you said, look, I travel the world. There's certain things that I probably wouldn't have experienced. I the same thing right here. So just a quick story. Like with my organization, there's certain perks that come with having sponsorships and relationships with U of H, with the Texans. So we work hard. We work incredibly hard and we're really trying to transform how our members experience us. But yesterday we were in a board meeting and CJ Stroud walks into the meeting. We had a chance, the board meeting stops. We all have a chance to step out. And I've had a chance to interact with his mom through some community events. So I tell his mom all the time, you're my friend, you just don't know it, but you're like you're a part of the family now. But literally had a chance to step out and take a picture with CJ Stroud and his mom. And so had I been in the same role that I was in, you know, years ago, I wouldn't have those opportunities. So there's some perks, tangible or no non-monetary perks that come with shifting, betting on yourself beyond the paycheck that you bring home. So bet on yourself.

SPEAKER_01 24:13

So look, look, I noticed a subtle Texans flat flex on that one, right? That was which, I mean, I don't know if you can see back there, but you see my like my Texans chapter chip. Massive. So look, I can be bought, right? So just be clear. Like next time you and CJ just hanging out at Starbucks, you know, just say, hey, can I call my close, close personal friend Josani, who's a massive fan. We're gonna put him on uh FaceTime real quick. Just just just put it out there.

SPEAKER_00 24:40

I got you. I'm gonna send you a picture so we can see the crew.

SPEAKER_01 24:43

I think your message, Kier, resonates with so many people in terms of the frustrations. And and here's what's funny. When you have to make those decisions to step out there, it usually is at a vulnerable time, right? It is it there's very rarely a, you know, paradigm shifting, career adjusting decision that you have to make that's at a perfect time. Very rarely is that. But it's funny because now you you reflect, now you have the benefit of time passing, and you have time to reflect, and you're like, man, I just couldn't see my career turning out any other way. And I think what I really want people to take from this point of this portion of the conversation is that you know in your spirit, right? You like I said, it's like any relationship. You know when you're valued, you know when you're growing, you know when you're evolving. You know, if you're getting what you need, you're getting developed, you're getting paid fair, and you're getting to experience things that's gonna that's gonna get you to the next point, you know, consider yourself blessed and continue to do that. If you if you're not getting that and you're asking for feedback and you're asking for opportunities, and you get the same lame excuses, and the reality doesn't mesh with the data that you're seeing, again, your mind and your body and your spirit tells you like, brother, sister, you got some decisions to make. But the truth of the matter is let you know, whether or not you choose to remain at your current company or you decide to explore other opportunities, you have to decide what is best for you. And I guess where I like to go also is a lot of times I have a, I've I talked to a lot of friends and family. And, you know, shouts off to blue-collar workers, folks who have hourly roles and things like that, because that decision-making process is a little bit different because they like to factor in overtime and things like that. But I'm

Money Versus Total Compensation

SPEAKER_01 26:20

always begging my friends and colleagues who are in that line of work is do not get tantalized with another quarter an hour, another dollar an hour and things like that, and look long-term into your look, look long-term before you decide to jump ship. Because especially in roles like that, tenure means a lot. Tenure gets a lot of perks and things like that. Have you ever coached people on like trying to have a long-term perspective? And like every nickel, you know, everything that glitters ain't gold, right? Everything, you know, jumping for another quarter an hour seems great, but trying to have that long-term perspective to really have fulfilling careers. Have you had to mentor people along those lines?

SPEAKER_00 26:54

Absolutely. I think there's there's the element of uh the monetary view, but there's also not allowing one negative experience to tank your career. And so I'll tell you, so being in HR and working behind the scenes, for example, to advocate for the best benefits for our employees has given me a different perspective. And so healthcare, for example, healthcare is skyrocketing in some cases 40 plus percent. And that cost burden is transferring to employers, but also the employers having to share that cost with the employees as well. So overseeing our total rewards department and working, we shout out to Willis Towers Watson, but that's that's our broker. And we meet on a monthly basis to talk about what's happening in the industry. And because we're self-funded, we haven't had to pass those funds to our employees. Our insurance benefits went up at this year about two to three percent, which compared to others who are not self-funded, it's been, yes, ridiculous. But I I share that to say sometimes people are only looking at their take-home pay and they're not always looking at total compensation plus experience, like work environment that people are in. And I challenge people always to think about okay, you might be leaving to you're making $20 here and you want to go over here to make $22. Make sure you're looking at their benefits. And we offer we coach leaders all the time to say, help them understand everything that we're offering so that if if this is a regrettable loss, they understand what they're walking away from. And I've actually had a couple people under HR who have thought about testing new waters and they've slept on it and said, you know what? I'm sorry, I want to stay. Like I now recognize that experience. So that's sort of the monetary perspective. Don't always leave for a couple dollars. It's not always worth it. And frankly, while an organization may be competing with salary, you can't always compete with culture. So that's something that we focus on at TDECU. How do we differentiate your culture and your experience at work, even if we're not the highest paying organization in the market? At the same time, back to brand. If just because you experience a negative interaction with somebody, I always tell people, step out of that situation, don't lose your cool. Don't allow someone to fluster your emotions openly to where you might tank your career, right? Because it's like the easiest way to find a job is when you have one. But when you are terminated or you get in some in a nice way I say it, when an organization frees up your future. If your future is freed, I will tell you that it is so difficult right now in the market to find a job. And just fresh off of uh Greater Houston Partnership meeting, they were talking about the number of jobs that were surfacing across the Greater Houston area. And while most industries are predicting to hire more folks for the year, there are many at this point, oil and gas, they're cutting jobs and retail, they're cutting jobs. And all of this is correlated to what's happening in the economy. So I'm going off on a tangent, but I'm simply saying that you have to think about the situation that you're in right now and determine if it's worth it to leave what you have. And if you're in a toxic environment, by all means, please don't stay. But if you're looking for a dollar, if you're chasing the dollar, every organization has frustrations. Every organization has some um challenges that you're gonna have to experience. Every organization has bad leaders. It's up to you to figure out how to escalate appropriately, appropriately to determine if you want to work in an environment that offers you a broader experience that fulfills your expectations.

SPEAKER_01 30:36

I think that's so it's so important for people to remember that, right? Look long term. Like your career needs to be a long game. It's not about jumping from job to job to job. You know, especially in a world where, you know, you tell people, oh, I've been at a company for 10 years. They look at you like you got three heads. You're like, really? 10 years. You know, but it's it comes down to, again, is your career being fed? Is your spirit being fed? Are you, you know, all these other things. Like, even when I like my wife and I, we talk about going, if we say, hey, I'm gonna go, we're gonna look at a church, right? We move to this side of town and we're like, okay, our spirits being fed, right? You know when that's when that's happening. Same thing with your employer. And and you said it right. Don't let one bad experience, all of a sudden, you act emotionally off of it, right? Yes. Managers can be jerks. And there are some pretty bad ones out there, uh, unfortunately. But I always look at my career and the decisions therein as a business transaction, right? I will never make a decision off of emotion unless it becomes so toxic or it just violates one of my moral codes or something like that. But if if you get into it with your manager and you have a conflict, you have a disagreement, don't do the whole, I'll show you, because here's what's gonna happen. Okay, yeah, you quit. And yes, there is that initial shock and awe that you did it. Um, and people will text you and they'll call you, like, oh my God, I can't believe you left or you did this thing. But your company's gonna be like, all right, well, cool, let's backfill it and we'll backfill it. And in three or four weeks, they've backfilled that role. And now you're struggling. You put yourself at a disadvantage just to show somebody.

SPEAKER_00 32:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:10

You need to treat those decisions as business decisions. And you and you don't make a business decision when you're emotional. You just simply don't. Um, and I think it's really important for people to listen, especially when you got a lot of employees dealing with difficult managers, dealing with sometimes toxic and toxic environments. And you're absolutely right. You should never, you should never work. If you're if it's a toxic place and it's destroying your mental health and you're on medication and you you know, all of a sudden it starts manifesting in the physical ailments because of the stress, yeah, get the hell out of there. Don't don't be anybody's punching bag, but don't let one bad interaction cause you to make a rash decision. I think that's what we're kind of saying, right?

SPEAKER_00 32:50

Yeah, I'll also say that stars your friend, right? And so it w to your point, you know, HR, my friend in HR, you know, often people people are afraid to go to human resources. And we have a job to do. We also serve as a neutral party to make sure that we mitigate risk across the organization. I encourage people to come to HR if and when they've followed appropriate protocols to escalate appropriately. And so that means if you have an issue at work, escalate to your manager. If it's with your manager, escalate to the next level. If you've exhausted all resources, if you've addressed it through maybe there's a third-party hotline or whatever the case is to report anonymously, perhaps it could be if it's a peer that you have an issue with, maybe you need to address your peer.

Why HR Gets Villainized

SPEAKER_00 33:40

Sometimes you don't need a mediator, but if you've exhausted all resources to try to make the situation better, come to human resources. We we're happy to support some of the challenges that an employee might experience.

SPEAKER_01 33:53

So you just said something that's gonna really set some people off. And I'm I'm can't wait for the comments, right? The comment, and so I intentionally call my program my friend, my friend in HR. Because, you know, honestly, it's if we, you know, HR, it's so easy to villainize HR, right? It's it's so easy. The number of managers who love to say, well, I wanted to promote you, but HR said I couldn't. I'm like, are you kidding me? Like, I wish HR had that kind of power. I wish we had that kind of authority. Things probably wouldn't be as bad as they are. But there's a lot of folks, there's a lot of folks, a lot of videos on TikTok and Instagram, and folks just have their whole social media about talking about how crappy HR is and HR isn't your friend. And I'm gonna say this and I would love to get your feedback. I always say, say, you you know, you know who else ain't your friend? Labor attorneys, which are half the people who are putting that stuff out there, right? All they see you is billable hours. Accounting ain't your friend, marketing ain't your friend, operations ain't your friend, right? They're all departments made up of people who are imperfect. And just like in just like in any other profession, there are some really, really great people, and there's some crappy ones. There's some great HR people who really believe in the mission in terms of supporting people, and there's some folks who probably should never talk to people ever again in terms of that. But there's this whole thing about HR supports the organization, not you. And I think the thing that's missed a lot of times that people don't talk about care is that the organization is made up of people. It's not just made up of managers, it's made up the employees and the managers. And our job is to mitigate the risk, figure out what's wrong, and then address it for the organization's sake, not necessarily for the employees or for the managers, but for the organization as a whole. When you hear people say try to villainize HR in the difficult position that we're often in, well, I mean, what is your initial response and feedback to all of that?

SPEAKER_00 35:43

I'll say this. You know, people love us when things are good, people hate us when it doesn't work in their favor. And so I, you know, HR has transformed over the last few decades to where we must be more strategic in our business. So we're not paper pushers, we're not transactional, we're not call us when there's an issue. What we do offer is transforming how people experience an organization. So what does that mean? We're here to develop, we're here to assess skills, we're here to work with the business to understand your needs and your strategies so that we can align talent to your organizational outcomes. We're also here to do the hard work. And so that means that again, you said it earlier, we are a business. We are a part of the business. So sometimes it means that if the business is not running effectively, efficiently, in a way that drives towards outcomes, guess what? That means that we have to help to make hard decisions, which means that sometimes that means it's exiting talent out of the organization. And on the most extreme case, it could mean that it requires a reduction in force. Now, hopefully that doesn't happen often across organizations, but the highest cost in most organizations is compensation. So if organizations aren't managing headcount in a way where they're thinking about skills versus looking at this in a widget perspective, I need 10, 15 people as opposed to here's the skill set that I need and HR partner with me to find this skill set. Well, if you look at peer data and it shows that your head count is heavier than others, sometimes you may have to make harder decisions. So there's a business side to human resources that is not always exploited or shared with others who only see us in a traditional light. And frankly, sometimes when you're not in the strategic conversations and you're only thinking about what's in it for me, it's easy to villainize HR. So I would, I would just offer that HR has an obligation to position ourselves as strategic partners, which means that we have to embed ourselves in the business and not be transactional at the same time as an organization. You've got to appreciate us in the good and the bad and the hard times. It's not even really bad times, it's the hard times. So I love that your, you know, your business is called My Friend and HR because if you have a really good friend, your friend is gonna tell you when things are good, and your friend is also going to be brutally honest when things aren't bad and help you navigate and make some of those decisions. So, you know, maybe that's your, I don't know what, you know, my friend and HR and what the root of that is, but I love that you call it that because people who have really good friends, my best friend today will tell me when I'm wrong. My best friend today will also help help me to think differently about how to navigate maybe some life challenges or things that I'm experiencing. Experiencing. So if people see HR in that manner, they can appreciate what our intent is and what we're trying to accomplish.

SPEAKER_01 38:41

Yeah. I mean, and and you know, the other thing I would like to also say about it is understand that when a lot of times the biggest complaint that employees have about HR sometimes is like they'll bring an issue, right? They'll it's a toxic manager, there's a mean manager, oh, this manager's disrespecting me, all these other things. And it's very real to the employee. And they feel like a lot of times, because they don't actually see the transaction or how it was dealt with, they feel like HR doesn't do anything. And a lot of times those personnel actions, if we, you know, let's say a manager does get some kind of disciplinary action or written up or whatever, unless they're like suspended, you don't see it. You don't see it because it's confidential, right? You don't, you don't go out and put it on the, you know, on the billboard. And that's what I sometimes I tell them, I tell employees. Well, no one ever got back to me on this investigation. No one ever came back and told me what was done. And and, you know, and I'm like, so what did they actually say? Well, they say we resolved, we, we dealt with the matter. And unfortunately, depending on what we're talking about, that might be the most they can tell you because, you know, they I ask people it all the time, think about if you got ridden of, or think about if you received some kind of disciplinary action. Do you want HR telling everybody about that? Well, so we have to, there's there's a balancing act in terms of that, but it's just all these things where this that HR is so involved in with the behind-the-scenes things. 80% of what we do, a lot of people don't see. So it's really easy to assume nothing is happening. When a lot of times HR loses so much sleep over like dealing with an issue or frustrations with managers when there's a poor decision coming down the pipe because we know the impact to employees. It's really hard sometimes. And again, I want to be balanced. I know there are some crappy HR people out there. I know a couple. There's there's one person the other day, I told them at happy hour, I was like, you should get out of this. You are gonna get somebody sued. I just tell it like it is. I'm telling you like it is too. You should get out of HR.

SPEAKER_00 40:28

So it's not the profession that you want to be in. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 40:31

I will also say this, and I'm this is really quickly. A lot of times, like if I interview a junior, a person who's like just got out of college or university, and they I want to get into HR. And I ask the question, so why do you want to be in human resources? To me, if a person I love people. I love people. Well, people don't love you in HR. What do you do? What do you do with no say people don't love you back? But I always say, like, if a person tells me, like, I'm in HR because I love people, I'm like, either one, you're too junior to know any better. Or two, there might be a little disin being a little disingenuous here, right? Okay, so because HR people, once you've been

Being The Only One In Rooms

SPEAKER_01 41:05

here for a decade, you can't help but be a little cynical. So All right. I want to move on to a last topic that you and I kind of have in common. And, you know, we don't shy away from difficult conversations because we ground our discussions in reality and what people are facing. You and I both are black executives. We work, we we have leadership roles in our organizations. And outside looking in, people will look at us and they'll say, these individuals have made it. They've arrived, they've, you know, all these, you know, the idea of what success typically looks like. But it's a challenge a lot of times, just being, that some of our colleagues don't necessarily understand or have to deal with. And, you know, you being a black female executive at a very large organization, um, I would assume there's a lot of times, Kira, that you are the only one of something in that room. And the pressure to deliver twice as much or be twice as good, sometimes self-imposed, sometimes it's judgment from others. But it's a very interesting and challenging place to be, especially when you balance your role as a senior executive for an organization. But you're still a black female with needs and challenges and things like that, everything that goes with that. Talk to me a little bit about that journey. And even as an executive, the challenges that you still face, experience, feel-I don't know which word is appropriate, but talk to us a little bit about that.

SPEAKER_00 42:27

Yeah, I so I get this question quite often, and I don't take for granted that I represent various populations, young, black, female, you know, you name it. And and I I'm honored to serve in a capacity where I have an opportunity to represent so many folks. Growing up, I I went to private school, Catholic private school. Shout out to my parents who sacrificed to send me to the school that had the best education. And so growing up, I was accustomed to and frankly was introduced to being one of the only ones at my from elementary all the way through high school. And so I think innately I build sort of this thick skin and this tolerance for being different in a room. So fast forward as I move into my profession, particularly at the executive level, I think the one thing that stands out is often I'm the youngest one in the the room. In this case, my so my CEO believes in diversity. And so as he rebuilt his team when he moved into his role, we've got an incredibly diverse executive team. With that being said, that's not always the case when I'm in be in other rooms, but I I embrace it and I welcome it. Now, there is a burden that comes with that because I love that you said sometimes things are self-imposed because I often overprepare because I want to ensure that when I present, when I speak, I show that I am more than prepared for whatever topic is at hand. So when questions are thrown. Way, I'm able to navigate those questions in a way that shows that I'm more than qualified for this role. As far as um challenges in terms of like, again, be it race, age, things of that nature, I've always believed in standing out. And to the point of like when I said, you know, my roots in terms of how my parents raise me, I embrace the differences, but I'm also very intentional. So I actually I use it as a part of my brand and who I am. My hope is that we're gonna live in a world where people don't necessarily just see me as the only one, which then allows me to continue to not it when I walk in the room, I I wanna stand out, but it's not because of my color or because I'm a female. I want to stand out because people see my brand and the level of influence that I have and the value that I'm bringing to a room. And so I I teach my kids this. And when I talk about private conversations in my family and with others who may be experiencing this, sometimes it's about embracing that difference, but not from the standpoint of age, race, sex, things of that nature. But it's really more so how do you embrace who you are so that when you walk in the room, people see you for who, you know, for what you bring and the value that you bring to an organization. Have there been experiences where people have sort of labeled me absolutely? And I'll just this a little, I'll be a little facetious right now, but you know, being the the youngest in the room, I've had board members say to me, Man, you're young. So I'll what I I've learned is that when people, man, you're young. Yeah, and I will take that compliment as long as I can. Now, when you start calling me old, that's when I'm gonna right now I embrace people saying that I'm young. My kids think I'm old. You know, it there's sort of this dichotomy of like, you know, how the world sees you versus the people that are most important to you, your your family and how they see you. But honestly, Jasani, I've learned to embrace differences and standing out in a room. Have there again, there have been difficult times where I've had to reflect on what this means or any labels that have been given to me, but I try to reverse those in a way that leans into my brand as opposed to, you know, young black female in the room.

SPEAKER_01 46:10

You know, and I was a very similar story. Um, we have so many similarities in my background. You know, I, you know, I don't have a sob story. I only had a single mother. No, I had both parents, and they worked very hard to give me a quality education. And and what came with that quality education sometimes was, you know, between, I want to say between kindergarten and probably up through sixth grade, they put me in private schools. And um, and a lot of times in a lot of my classes, I was one of the few black kids in the class. And then you elevate, you go on, and I when I went to military college. So I went to miss so I went to military college. My first two years of U in the university, it was at Milledgeville, Georgia. It was at Georgia Military College. Now, for those who aren't aware of their Civil War history, Milledgeville, Georgia was the original headquarters of the Confederacy before it moved to Atlanta. As a matter of fact, our administration building was literally called the Old Capitol building. So that brought some challenge, some very unique experiences and challenges that I will share over Happy Hour. But it's one of those, but it's one of those things where, yeah, sticking out and being different has always been that way. Like a lot of times I have been too black to hang out with the white kid white colleagues and too and acted acted too white to hang out with the black kids. Growing up, I was the one kid on my block who really didn't play basketball. You didn't really want to pick me because I kind of sucked at it. But you know, oh, you know, black guy, you should be playing basketball. I should pick you. And so that's just kind of been an experience. I think folks that have kind of been our shoes have experienced in terms of like embracing the difference, embracing our uniqueness, but at the same time recognizing, as you said very eloquently earlier, recognizing that we represent more than ourselves. Because unfortunately, we do live in a world that people love to stereotype folks and they love to say, well, they got that role because of X, Y, and Z, or that self-imposed judgment that sometimes still plays in my head sometimes in terms of having to prove myself. That that thing kind of echoes, still echoes in my head even after all these years. What is your thought about that?

SPEAKER_00 48:06

Yeah, I mean, uh, I'll say this. You know, there's been private experiences that I've navigated where I feel like I um, you know, I wasn't chosen for various reasons. And I'll tell you that during COVID, when we started seeing some of the injustices happening across the world, that was the first time that I had a chance to share my stories and my experiences in an open forum. And I'll never forget I was a part of a DEI panel with HR Houston. Um, and I think it was at a period where Gulf Coast Symposium was virtual. And one of the team members from HR Houston tapped me on the shoulder and said, Hey, Kira, you know, I'd love for you to be a part of this panel, but you know, can you talk to me about your experiences? So we shared some private experiences, and she was like, Kira, I actually saw you as different. Like I never thought that you experienced some of these injustices that others of your race or your sex or your age have experienced. And so I had to openly share that, you know, discrimination, it doesn't matter how you grew up, where you grew up, it happens across, you know, all experiences in life. And discrimination um doesn't, you know, discrimination discriminates, right? Uh across all areas. So having those opportunities during COVID to be able to openly talk about some of my experiences, but also lessons in overcoming uh was sort of therapeutic for me. So I agree with everything that you said, Josani. You know, we have to figure out how to not let these things uh hold us back, but also lean into who we are, who we believe. I can't emphasize enough the value that we're bringing in any room that we walk in and recognize that we're representing something bigger than ourselves and bring others along so that when folks are stuck, we're helping them overcome some of these challenges so they can show up and be their best.

SPEAKER_01 50:02

And I think the last thing I'll say on that topic is I think it's really important, regardless of where what your background is, is that you have to be courageous when the time calls for it, right? And it could be anything like you're in a room full of peers, executive peers, and an off-color joke is is made, right? And you know, there's that pressure, do I say anything or do I rock the boat? When you see someone basically making a stereotype saying, well, she may not be able to do this role because you know she has three or four kids, and you're like, hmm, really, is that really a factor of the job? You know, and we have to, whether again, race, gender, whatever, age, when we see these conversations happening, it's in the heat of those moments that culture is forged, not in a vision statement or a mission statement. And that is how we bring people along. That is how we represent, you know, the folks who have helped us get to where we are. And that's how we bring people along, is that in those rooms where most people aren't allowed, when we see whether it's intentional bias or anything like that, we as leaders, regardless of who we are or what we look like, we have to have the courage to say, wait a minute, guys, I personally believe we're better than that. And so that comment we just made probably is not is it's probably not appropriate. Um, and I want to make sure that we kind of stay where we need to be in terms of walking down that path that we know our organization should be.

unknown 51:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:19

That that tends to be a very it takes courage. It takes courage because everybody's like everybody's worried about their bonus, everybody's worried about their current. And if I say anything, maybe I will make myself a target. But I think nowadays it's even more important for the leaders to do just that lead.

SPEAKER_00 51:34

Yeah, I just don't be a part of the problem, right? Just speak up. When you see something injustice happening in any shape or form, speak up. And I'll I'll just add this to this topic that you just mentioned. Everybody has a story, right? And so nobody's life is perfect, everybody's life is imperfect. And so when you bring humanity to work and to life every day, you have a little bit more empathy for people who have a story. Everybody is fighting a battle in some shape or form. And so that's what keeps me humble because it boy, do I have a lot of personal things that I've experienced this year that we can talk about one day. But there's been some humility in navigating, you know, health challenges with my son and other things that have opened up my eyes to people's private stories that you may not even have visibility to. So we need to assume positive intent with people, bring humility and humanity

Long Game Takeaways And Closing

SPEAKER_00 52:30

to conversations and to your experiences so that you can allow people to just be.

SPEAKER_01 52:36

Well, I mean, this has been a great conversation. And Kira, I appreciate your honesty and throughout the conversation, vulnerability to share aspects of your story. Um, I think these are the kind of moments that makes HR and just leaders in in general become more human, right? To share, like we do have concerns, we do have vulnerabilities. We didn't all just get here overnight. There was a journey, and we skinned our knees a few times along the way. But because through the power of networking and collaboration and mentors and just people bringing us forward, it not only helped us get to where we are, but it puts us in a position to pay it forward and bring people along on the journey with us. And I think that's really, really important. And I want to thank you so much for joining us today and having that discussion with the community. I I know folks, some folks got fed through this conversation. I know I did. I know I gained a couple of pounds getting fed on this conversation.

SPEAKER_00 53:29

I did as well. Just only thank you for creating a platform for professionals to come in and just talk openly about their experiences. I think this is important. By the way, shout out to your 10,000 plus followers. I'm so proud of you. I'm excited to be in that circle of your followers. I follow your journey, continue to make a difference in everything that you do. Very, very proud of you. Keep killing it.

SPEAKER_01 53:53

Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Again, it's great when one of your heroes gives you a compliment. So I'm gonna, when we get off camera, I'm gonna go put that in my diary and we're just gonna, you know, I'm gonna do all that. Um, but Kara, thank you so much for joining us. And folks, remember, authenticity is not just important, it's critical, right? This journey that we call our careers, every decision we make matters. Have a long-term perspective. Don't always chase the grasses greener, make good business-related decisions. And remember that as we evolve and as we grow in our careers, that we have an obligation to bring people along on that journey with us. Because just like we needed help at some point, somebody somewhere needs that assistance as well. And we'll continue to pay that forward. We'll help our organizations thrive because I personally believe, I know Kira believes this too, that providing fulfilling careers for our employees and business results aren't mutually exclusive. Sometimes they go very hand in hand. So I want to thank the community for going along this journey and letting me go on this journey with you. We're gonna continue to come out with great content going into the new year. I got some really cool projects. By the time this airs, we will probably have already done it, but we're getting ready to do our first webinar that Kiera is going to be front and center on. So I thank her for volunteering to do that. And we're gonna talk about how do we charge into 2026 boldly and just go ahead and conquer this thing and set ourselves up for success, provide value to our organizations, and have fulfilling careers. So, from all of us at My Friend and HR, be well. Not just to yours, not just to others, but to yourself as well. And remember that your job is meant to support your life. Your life is not meant to support your job, and we'll see you soon.